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CONSTANTINVS MAXIMVS
07-11-2004, 04:49 PM
a good read

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3883605.stm

Long history of intelligence failures


By Paul Reynolds
BBC News Online world affairs correspondent




The intelligence failure over Iraq will take a prominent place in the history of notable intelligence breakdowns.

These range, if you want to go back far enough, from the wooden horse in Troy to, in modern times, Stalin's refusal to believe that Germany would invade the Soviet Union in 1941, and the British belief that they would have warning of an Argentine invasion of the Falkland Islands in 1982.

Intelligence also failed to warn against - let alone stop - the two sudden and daring strikes against the US, at Pearl Harbor in 1941 and on 11 September 2001.

Intelligence failures can be put into a number of categories:

Overestimation

This is characterised by a determination to overemphasise information, leading to a false conclusion.

The Senate Intelligence Committee has detailed how this happened over Iraq.

But there is another example of this, which nearly led to disaster in the Cold War.

It is known as Operation Ryan, an acronym for the Russian words raketno-yadernoye napadenie, meaning nuclear missile attack.

Ryan was a KGB operation in the early 1980s, when Ronald Reagan was president.

It was based on a fear that the US was going to launch a missile attack on the Soviet Union.

KGB agents around the world were told to look out for unusual signs of military activity and, of course, found them or said they did.

In their book, KGB: The Inside Story, Soviet defector Oleg Gordievsky and espionage writer Christopher Andrew give a hilarious account of how KGB agents looked out for lights on unusually late in places such as the British Foreign Office.

Fortunately, the West had Gordievsky to warn it about this Soviet state of mind.

Reassuring signals were put out and danger was averted.

Underestimation

This is the syndrome in which the intelligence services or the political leadership completely misread the enemy's intentions.

In 1941, Stalin was apparently convinced that Hitler would not invade the Soviet Union, despite strong military signs to the contrary and urgent warnings from Britain and the US.

Churchill even passed on some intelligence - gained from the Ultra secret, the reading of the German Enigma codes - that Germany had deployed new armoured formations in southern Poland.

There was also a Soviet spy in Switzerland who sent Moscow the date on which the invasion would start, 22 June.

Stalin did not want to know.

To this day, nobody really knows why.

This category is closely linked to the next.

Over-confidence

Here, one side is so confident of its ability that it projects its reasoning onto the other side and believes that since it would not do something itself, nor will the other side.

The classic case is the Yom Kippur war of October 1973.

The Israelis had what was called the "concept" - Egypt could not win a war, so it would not start a war.

In fact, Egypt had the more limited aim of establishing a bridgehead across the Suez Canal and converting this into a diplomatic victory. It did so.

The Israeli commission of inquiry was highly critical of the "concept", and Prime Minister Golda Meir resigned.

Complacency

This happens when you know the enemy might do something, though you are not sure what or when, and yet you do nothing anyway.

The British suffered from this over the Falkland Islands in 1982.


The Argentine military junta had made it clear that it wanted to gain sovereignty.

Yet even when negotiations stalled in early 1982, Britain did nothing to prevent an invasion.

The British ambassador in Buenos Aires called it the Micawber policy after the Dickensian character who hoped that something would "turn up".

What turned up was the invasion of the islands and a bloody little war.

However, an inquiry by Lord Franks, a former diplomat, said the government was not to blame because the Argentines had acted unpredictably.

Something similar happened when Saddam Hussein invaded Kuwait in 1990.

People thought he might do so, but hoped he would not and did nothing.

On the whole, it is as well to fear the worst when a dictator makes threats and moves armies.

Ignorance

When there is virtually no intelligence, you are at the mercy of events.

While it is the case that there were signs in 1941 of aggressive Japanese intentions towards the US, nobody in a senior position expected the attack on Pearl Harbor.

It was carried out with skill and surprise.

But ignorance should not lead to inaction.

The US Congress issued a stinging report because no adequate steps were taken in Pearl Harbor itself to cover against an attack.

Although the radar station picked up the approach of the Japanese aircraft, nobody could interpret the signs and there were no aircraft ready to repel them.

Failure to join the dots

This is the failure to make connections between bits of intelligence to make a coherent whole.

It is more easily identified afterwards than at the time.

One of the main charges against the CIA and FBI post-9/11 was that they failed to join up the dots beforehand - the presence in the US of known suspects, the unusual number of men from the Middle East taking flying courses, the known tactic of al Qaeda to use aircraft, etc.

Finally, a word about that wooden horse.

The key intelligence failure was that the Trojans ignored a warning.

It came from Cassandra, the daughter of Troy's King Priam.

Given the gift of prophecy, she had then angered the God Apollo, who ordained that her prophecies should never be believed.

So the Trojans rejected what they said was her "windy nonsense".

A myth perhaps, but there is a lesson to be learned.

The trouble is that lessons are not always learned, which is why the list of intelligence failures grows longer.

Ixabert
07-11-2004, 05:29 PM
Even most anti-Stalin historians agree that Stalin never trusted Hitler.

J.V. Stalin
"The Tasks of Business Executives"
Speech Delivered at the First All-Union Conference
of Leading Personnel of Socialist Industry
February 4, 1931

"It is sometimes asked whether it is not possible to slow
down the tempo somewhat, to put a check on the movement.
No, comrades, it is not possible! The tempo must not
be reduced! On the contrary, we must increase it as much
as is within our powers and possibilities. . . .

"To slacken the tempo would mean falling behind. And those
who fall behind get beaten. But we do not want to be
beaten. No, we refuse to be beaten! One feature of the
history of old Russia was the continual beatings
she suffered because of her backwardness. She
was beaten by the Mongol khans. She was beaten by the
Turkish beys. She was beaten by the Swedish feudal lords.
She was beaten by the Polish and Lithuanian gentry. She
was beaten by the British and French capitalists. She
was beaten by the Japanese barons. All beat her--
because of her backwardness, because of her military
backwardness, cultural backwardness, political backwardness,
industrial backwardness, agricultural backwardness. . . .

"In the past we had no fatherland, nor could we have had
one. But now that we have overthrown capitalism and power is
in our hands, in the hands of the people, we have a fatherland,
and we will uphold its independence. Do you want our socialist
fatherland to be beaten and to lose its independence? If you
do not want this, you must put an end to its backwardness
in the shortest possible time and develop a genuine Bolshevik
tempo in building up its socialist economy. There is no
other way. That is why Lenin said on the eve of the October
Revolution: 'Either perish, or overtake and outstrip the
advanced capitalist countries.'

"We are fifty or a hundred years behind the advanced countries.
We must make good this distance in ten years. Either we do it,
or we shall go under."

CheTheButcher
07-11-2004, 05:59 PM
Even most anti-Stalin historians agree that Stalin never trusted Hitler.

Unfortunately that didn't stop the huge military blunder of the first weeks of the war. :(

While it is the case that there were signs in 1941 of aggressive Japanese intentions towards the US, nobody in a senior position expected the attack on Pearl Harbor.

This is probably true. However, the morning before the attack a U.S. boat engaged a Japanese mini-sub. This should have set off the alarm but nobody paid attention.

Dr. Brandt
07-19-2004, 11:24 PM
These are all not "intelligence failures" but deliberate actions, traps to set off a War.
The USA knew the Japs would attack, they wanted them to attack, so they could finaly get into the War!

Stalin also knew, but he didn't care, because he thought he would be faster. Barbarossa started just 2 weeks before Stalin could start his Offensive "summer Storm".

Kuwaitt - of course Amerikwa knew. Saddam asked the US-Ambassador April Gilaspy if it were ok, and they answered "Go right ahead, its none of our buisness". It was a trap, so the USA could finaly set up Bases in the middle East.

Sinclair
07-20-2004, 01:32 AM
The Red Army was nowhere within 2 weeks of ability to launch a real offensive.

They were within 2 weeks of assuming their assigned positions, which seemed offensive because of the ideology of "People's War".

cerberus
07-20-2004, 01:46 AM
Can you name your source Dr. Brandt ?
Stalin was told that germany was going to attack , he even forbade any counter attack as he didn't believe he was being attacked.
If he was within 2 weeks of going to war himself he was still being more than good about sending materials to Germany and keeping to his side of trade aggreements.
Would like to see what your source is on the " Summer Storm".
Mobilisation must have been at an advacned stage if war was only two weeks away ?
What is your source as to the US knowing exactly where Japan would attack ?
They would have "known " the whereabouts of the japanese carrier force ?
Seems that a chance to ambush them as soon as they attacked was missed , again would like to know your source.
What would the assurance be that they would become engaged in anything other than a war against Japan , this would in the long run have been to the interests of the isolationist voice and ultimately in Germany's interests.
Some details on your sources would be appreciated.

Dr. Brandt
07-20-2004, 10:04 AM
The Red Army was nowhere within 2 weeks of ability to launch a real offensive.

They were within 2 weeks of assuming their assigned positions, which seemed offensive because of the ideology of "People's War".

Why don't you just shut up? I'm getting tierd of you smartass constantly busting into intelligent discussions with your one liner denials and parotting of the PC "official" History.
The "Istwestija" even admitted it, Russian Historians admitt it even. Viktor Suworow has written several books on it (And I have read them all!), the Documents and Plans for the attack have been found, signed by Shukow. Stalins Speech of 19th September 1939 has been found in the secret Archives. (A Speech that was denied to have ever been held untill the 1990ys) - and then you come in here and flap of your mouth sying "no".

cerberus
07-20-2004, 12:27 PM
Dr. Brandt,
Can you please name the books you refer to giving date of publication , publisher details and quote from the refernce material guide the state archive file numbers of the recent discovered speeches .
I would like to read up on these as it would seem that they have so far escaped any news of their discovery.
Thanks in advance.